Billax: Those rolls are looking mightly perfect. I picked up the ladybug tie a while back - still looking for an opportunity to wear it.

 

Four Liberty Bell collar rolls: 1) BB Broadcloth w/ silk emblematic, 2) J Press Chambray with Silk Grenadine Fina 3) JPress OCBD with Wool paisley foulard 4) BB Pinpoint with critter tie (Ladybugs) - all tied with four-in-hand knot

Please sir, may I have another!!!!

 

Should I contribute pics of my Mercer & Sons collar? I happen to be wearing one today.

 

Yes, please. Since you awoke to find yourself in one today. :icon_smile:

 

My question would be different: what am I doing wrong? My BB must-iron pinpoint button collars just flat out don't roll. They sort of rumple instead. What gives?

 

I thought that I would a few of mine.

 

Spin, Eagle, Tilton, and Garasaki: Thank you for your compliments. I read AAAT regularly, and enjoy many of the topics. When I find one that I believe I can make a contribution to, I do. However, I post my looks on a smaller, quieter, more reflective forum. As a geezer, it's more suitable to me.

AAAT covers all the topics, has a wide age and experience range, it's energetic, sometimes contentious, suffers a few poseurs, and has terrific moderators. I think that's a good thing for most guys trying to achieve a classic Ivy League look. Speaking of a classic Ivy League look, I am in complete agreement with Trad-ish, who recommends OCBD's fine blog post on collar roll. OCBD is a guy who, in my opinion, has made exemplary progress in attaining the classic Ivy look. He is very careful about his purchases, makes very few mistakes, and sequences his purchases to acquire apparel pieces that complete his classic Ivy wardrobe. He's done this better and more thoughtfully than any younger guy I've seen. His blog is pleasant reading for me!

Back on the topic, I wrote a brief reminiscence about what's currently called the "Liberty Bell" collar at my other place. I hadn't intended to post it here, but posters on this topic have asked good questions. My short write-up and sketch adds precious little to the discussion, save for some possible background. Still ....

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Here I sketch out the mathematical reasons why the Liberty Bell collar roll is such a classic. I didn't originate this notion, but was led to it by the Scotsman owner of the Campus Ivy store where I was lucky enough to work when I was in college. He said something like this: "The perfection of the Classic button-down collar with a four-in-hand tie is the result of the resolved tension between two sets of opposing curves. One opposing pair of ogee curves and another opposing pair of arcs." He had a slight burr, which can't be duplicated in print, but was great to listen to nonetheless.

I reproduce here what he drew for me in 1959 or 1960:

He didn't use the phrase "Liberty Bell Collar" but rather the "Classic Collar." I liked his explanation then and I like it today.
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Since I believe that the 14" x 14" rectangle including collar, tie, dimple, arch, lapels, gorge, bloom, belly, and - optionally - pocket square, is the single most noticed area of a man's look, it's well worth getting these elements right!

 

^ Great illustration, Bill, and thank you. This contrasts completely with Bolton's collar roll from an earlier post which is awful.

 

Seeing that the Button-down collar is the MOST visible distinction between the ivy League Look and the cutaway collar of the Style Forum, here are a few more examples:

 

Seeing that the Button-down collar is the MOST visible distinction between the ivy League Look and the cutaway collar of the Style Forum, here are a few more examples:

I could not stop looking at this one. The shoulders on that jacket combined with its color with that blue of the shirt. Pretty fantastic.

 

While I have seen and read the pictorials by both Billax and OCBD, I have to say that it is wonderful to see them again. These two fine gentlemen know what they're talking about!

In my experience, I usually achieve success with the roll (if we want to think of this as a thing to achieve success with) if I'm wearing a properly fitting shirt and a good tie--and if I can produce a good knot (four in hand) with the tie. At the same time, I just do the best I can and then forget it, i.e., I don't obsess over the course of my day about how my roll looks. When I think of the sartorial role models (no pun intended) I look to from decades ago, I don't think of them as the sort of men who ran to the restroom mirror every half-hour to check their look. Likewise, I don't want to be so encumbered by my vanity.