Men's Clothing Forums banner
1 - 20 of 27 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
431 Posts
Is this article intended to do anything but be incendiary and promote class hatred?

All of this class warfare rhetoric starts with the basic assumption that the rich somehow got their money unfairly. Some people have been lucky enough to be born into wealth. Some have surely made money through manipulation, dishonest business practices and outright illegality. But surprisingly, many have actually made their money through talent, hard work and ingenuity. Are we supposed to hate them because they have been successful?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,297 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,297 Posts
I think it's a bit ironic that many of the people who have benefited so much from this explosion in wealth, are the ones who are now begging the US taxpayer to "socialize" their losses.
What about people making bad life decisions who end up on the government dole? Aren't they asking the U.S. taxpayer to socialize their losses. What about medicare, medicaid, social security and any number of entitlement programs?

The steps being taken here are not intended to bail out wall street fat cats. They are designed to stabilize the financial markets so that the economy doesn't go off the deep end.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
431 Posts
I think it's a bit ironic that many of the people who have benefited so much from this explosion in wealth, are the ones who are now begging the US taxpayer to "socialize" their losses.
I agree. All this weekend I keep thinking of that scene from Airplane- "They bought their tickets, they knew what they were getting into. I say let 'em crash."

In the end, these government bailouts will encourage more risky behavior. When a business fails as the result of risky behavior, it discourages others from doing the same. When the government steps in and saves these firms it will just encourage more of the same.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
105 Posts
Did I just any relevant point in the article or was it just page after page of whining? The rich behave just like regular people and treat themselves to excessive gifts and toys. In the US everyone does it, even those that can't afford to still treat themselves to luxury. I can drive through the dumpiest parts of my rural town and nearly every drive way is filled with a late model car. The roof may be a tarp but that new mustang sure is shiny. People spend more than they save, credit card debt is through the roof. Most people don't even put away the means to retire without government assistance. To me it sounds like someone is just cranky that some people have the means to actually live the lavish way most people try to.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
27 Posts
I would prefer a world where wealth was equally distributed, I doubt it will ever happen, but it is certainly an ideal that I consider a good.

That being said, I used to bemoan the extravagances of the rich but now I have changed my tune. When someone of extreme wealth is able to splurge on items of luxury, the craftsmen that make said items are kept gainfully employed and an otherwise forgotten art may live on.

I don't want master craftsmen to have to abandon their trade and take on another job, or a secondary means of employment. I want them to do what they do best with focus and the freedom of a decent living.

If this means that the craftsmen must cater to the wealthy in order for the trade to survive - then so be it. Perhaps one day every village will return to a place where a tailor, cobbler, and furniture maker are all supported by the community. But until that day, in this era of mass produced soulless crap; I thank the rich for their excesses - they are keeping the arts alive.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
105 Posts
I would prefer a world where wealth was equally distributed, I doubt it will ever happen, but it is certainly an ideal that I consider a good.

That being said, I used to bemoan the extravagances of the rich but now I have changed my tune. When someone of extreme wealth is able to splurge on items of luxury, the craftsmen that make said items are kept gainfully employed and an otherwise forgotten art may live on.

I don't want master craftsmen to have to abandon their trade and take on another job, or a secondary means of employment. I want them to do what they do best with focus and the freedom of a decent living.

If this means that the craftsmen must cater to the wealthy in order for the trade to survive - then so be it. Perhaps one day every village will return to a place where a tailor, cobbler, and furniture maker are all supported by the community. But until that day, in this era of mass produced soulless crap; I thank the rich for their excesses - they are keeping the arts alive.
Just to play with the hypotheticals though, you ask for an equal distribution of wealth but also want people to be good at their trades. What incentive is there for me as a worker to do my best if all my extra hard work and dedication earns me the same as the guy that is phoning it in?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,031 Posts
Is this article intended to do anything but be incendiary and promote class hatred?

All of this class warfare rhetoric starts with the basic assumption that the rich somehow got their money unfairly. Some people have been lucky enough to be born into wealth. Some have surely made money through manipulation, dishonest business practices and outright illegality. But surprisingly, many have actually made their money through talent, hard work and ingenuity. Are we supposed to hate them because they have been successful?
Well said.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,193 Posts
I would prefer a world where wealth was equally distributed, I doubt it will ever happen, but it is certainly an ideal that I consider a good.
This is a bit tangetial to your thought, but I am of the belief that if tomorrow all the world's wealth was collected and distributed equally to all of the world's people, it would only be a matter of time before the wealth distribution would once again be sorted out fairly similarly to what we see today.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
27 Posts
Just to play with the hypotheticals though, you ask for an equal distribution of wealth but also want people to be good at their trades. What incentive is there for me as a worker to do my best if all my extra hard work and dedication earns me the same as the guy that is phoning it in?
Fair question. I believe that those who are free to do what they love for a living will always strive for excellence. For personal reasons and natural competitiveness within their field.

You also seek to do excellent work for the man "phoning it in" because he in turn ply's his trade for you.

Once again, this may be very "pie in the sky" and require a planet of Vulcan's to work.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,922 Posts
So, in your communist fantasyland, who gets their jackets made by Rubinacci and who gets theirs made by Mens Wearhouse?

Heh, the answer is that nobody gets any at all, except the party members. Societies of equals don't need luxuries like suits, except for the most equal among them.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
754 Posts
Did I just any relevant point in the article or was it just page after page of whining? The rich behave just like regular people and treat themselves to excessive gifts and toys. In the US everyone does it, even those that can't afford to still treat themselves to luxury. I can drive through the dumpiest parts of my rural town and nearly every drive way is filled with a late model car. The roof may be a tarp but that new mustang sure is shiny. People spend more than they save, credit card debt is through the roof. Most people don't even put away the means to retire without government assistance. To me it sounds like someone is just cranky that some people have the means to actually live the lavish way most people try to.
I don't necessarily agree with the last sentence here but the rest of it is spot-on. The Times article is dog bites man. The excesses of the super-rich have always been with us; the excesses of the middle class and below are the real story worth writing about.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,185 Posts
Being envious of wealth presupposes that being really, really, rich is superfabulous.

I wouldn't turn it down, but astounding wealth pales in the face of being healthy, happily-partnered, or being in possession of a bowl of very good ice cream.

You just can't buy fun!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,196 Posts
Did I just any relevant point in the article or was it just page after page of whining? The rich behave just like regular people and treat themselves to excessive gifts and toys. In the US everyone does it, even those that can't afford to still treat themselves to luxury. I can drive through the dumpiest parts of my rural town and nearly every drive way is filled with a late model car. The roof may be a tarp but that new mustang sure is shiny. People spend more than they save, credit card debt is through the roof. Most people don't even put away the means to retire without government assistance. To me it sounds like someone is just cranky that some people have the means to actually live the lavish way most people try to.
+1, it is hilarious to see Escalades in an Aldi's parking lot.
 

·
Connoisseur/Curmudgeon Emeritus - Moderator
Joined
·
37,088 Posts
...People spend more than they save, credit card debt is through the roof. Most people don't even put away the means to retire without government assistance. To me it sounds like someone is just cranky that some people have the means to actually live the lavish way most people try to.
Cranky has nothing to do with it. You have stated in a nicely succient fashion, on an individual scale, exactly why our Country is having to assume $700B, plus in unfunded obligations to bailout those irresponsible individual and corporate cretins, who have chosen to live larger than they could afford. Talk about wealth redistribution, in it's ugliest sense!
 
1 - 20 of 27 Posts
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top