With the demise of Corbin and Majer it has been a rough go for Trad stores and their former customers. Used to buy suits, sport coats and trousers for reasonable prices that average guys could afford. Now what few makers are left tend to be higher priced such as Southwick and some Canadian firms all wanting 900 for sport coats and around 1200 for suits. Gone are the days of visiting the local Trad store and ordering from the in stock Corbin and Majer catalogs and seeing those selections a few days later. Gone also are the shirt makers like Kenneth Gordon ands Sero. Alden wants a small fortune for a pair of shoes now as they focus on the more lucrative Asian market. Good bye Trad stores and Trad clothing makers, it was nice while it lasted.
Priced Out of Trad Market
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Hence the value of Ask Andy! There are deals still to be had, and the PSAs here help you find them. IME some regular events really worth checking are the semiannual J. Press markdowns, the Bahle’s sales, and the O’Connell’s sales plus their markdowns on their shirts, separate from their regular sale. And then, bittersweet, are events like BB clearing out their Alden inventory as they take on new lines. Lastly, there are a few purveyors out there that have some long running deals, notably Hunter and Coggins and Orvis. Chipp ties are very nice and well priced IMHO. Keep the faith and support TNSIL clothiers!
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I wonder how expensive these clothes are compared to the 1950s and 60s in real terms. I assume someone has done that analysis online. It seems the smaller customer base (and higher domestic manufacturing costs) would mean prices are higher now, but I suppose the college students who bought Ivy League clothes were also quite well off.
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To be a college student in the '40's and '50's, especially in the Ivy League, was to be well off. Sorry, but that's where it was (unless you were a GI Bill student). Those of us who went to University in the '60's either went to state supported schools or were well off. You don't get into Hahvahd, Yile or Dahtmuth if you're middle class unless you're a member of a minority that Hahvahd, Dahtmuth or Yile thinks will benefit their white upper class undergrads. Get over it. Shop thrift or break into your 501K.
Price inflation since 1960 is 763%.
So, just looking at inflation, and ignoring the MANY other market factors, regulatory changes, etc, you'd expect the $1000 suit of today to have cost $115 then... which sounds about right.
(I'm not interested enough to research it, but I'm betting the "sweet spot" for suit pricing was probably $99?)
The real problem is income inequality - in which executive/professional income has well-exceeded the rate of inflation since the 1970s, while other wages have been relatively stagnant, so much of the population has simply been priced out of decent clothes (bear in mind that if the minimum wage had tracked executive income since then, it would be something like $55/hour).
The median personal wage in the USA is $31,000/year - there's no reasonable scenario in which that person buys a $1000 suit, or probably even a $500 one. Since none of the people in their social or occupational sphere do either, it has redefined clothing standards to something affordable (like tee shirts and cargo shorts).
Priced out of trad? Absolutely.
DH
So, just looking at inflation, and ignoring the MANY other market factors, regulatory changes, etc, you'd expect the $1000 suit of today to have cost $115 then... which sounds about right.
(I'm not interested enough to research it, but I'm betting the "sweet spot" for suit pricing was probably $99?)
The real problem is income inequality - in which executive/professional income has well-exceeded the rate of inflation since the 1970s, while other wages have been relatively stagnant, so much of the population has simply been priced out of decent clothes (bear in mind that if the minimum wage had tracked executive income since then, it would be something like $55/hour).
The median personal wage in the USA is $31,000/year - there's no reasonable scenario in which that person buys a $1000 suit, or probably even a $500 one. Since none of the people in their social or occupational sphere do either, it has redefined clothing standards to something affordable (like tee shirts and cargo shorts).
Priced out of trad? Absolutely.
DH
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LOL. My closet is filled with purchases from Brooks Brothers, J. Press, O'Connell's, Orvis, Allen Edmonds, Alden, etc., and I have paid full retail price for almost nothing. Now that's the ticket!
PS: There have been a few (too many) high flyer purchases over the years, but those have been driven by a lack of patience on my part. It is the patient hunter who gets the kill!
PS: There have been a few (too many) high flyer purchases over the years, but those have been driven by a lack of patience on my part. It is the patient hunter who gets the kill!
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Just for fun-----------
Here are two, and only two, examples showing the prices that venerable Main Street clothiers were offering to the suburban fellow in 1965 (I cannot vouch for how "trad" the clothing was because the ads are light on the descriptions--although some of the shirts seemed to be tradly enough). And one of the stores really was on Main Street:
Haney & Holbrook (whose motto was "Things to wear for men who care") was located on South Main Street in Kannapolis, North Carolina. From its newspaper ad on December 30, 1965, announcing its winter sale:
Sport coats, regularly priced from $35.00 to $49.95, on sale for $29.88 to $39.88.
Men's and Young Men's wool slacks, ordinarily $12.95 to $18.95, reduced to $10.88 to $15.88.
Sport shirts by Arrow, Manhattan, and Enro: Regularly up to $6.95, all on sale for $1.94.
Dress shirts--both stripes and solids--reduced from $5.00 to $3.88.
******
Cogburn's (which evidently did not have a slogan) was on Harrison Avenue in downtown Panama City, Florida. From its newspaper ad on December 30, 1965:
"Check with us before you go back to college...the most wanted clothing at sensationally low prices."
"Famous make" suits were priced as follows:
Regularly $69.50 to $75.00, on sale for $50.00
Regularly $59.50 to $65.00, reduced to $40.00
Regularly $49.95 $55.00, now $33.00
$39.95 to $45.00, sale priced at $27.50
Sport coats and blazers:
Full price: $39.95 to $47.00, on sale for $33.00
Regularly $35.00, now $26.00
Full price: $29.95, sale: $21.00
Dress and sport shirts (buttondown collars):
Regular: $5.00 to $5.95, sale: $3.33
Regular: $6.50 to $7.95, sale: $4.75
Regular: $8.95 to $10.95, sale $6.00
Regular: $10.95, sale: $7.00
Fall slacks: Ordinarily $7.95 to $20.00, now 20% off
Online inflation calculators can readily tell you what the above dollar amounts are in current dollars. The clothing wasn't exactly cheap ($7.00 in 1965 would be around $56.00 now, and households then--unlike now--tended to have just one wage earner, and those wages would have to be spread out to support more children than is generally the case these days). On the other hand, it's likely that the clothing was made in the USA--a quality for which we pay a hefty premium now.
And since trad-ish clothing was fairly prevalent in the USA in the 1950s and '60s, it could even be found at budgety retailers such as Sears, Penney's, and Montgomery Ward.
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I was just in Hunter and Coggins last week. Jim Hunter is a fine clothier from the old school and works hard to keep goods and prices affordable. All-- Please frequent his online store and if you're anywhere near Asheville NC, stop by. He usually has a nice rack of previous season goods at some really good prices.
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Great looking store (with obligatory clunky site). I will do my best to support it - I've added it to my bookmarks so I'll keep it in mind when looking for something. Has a resemblance to O'Connells.
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I would say "manipulate" instead of command, but then probably unlike your prof I don't think that power, such as it is, is turning out to be a good thing.
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I've not tried his shetlands due to favoring lambswool, but his Alan Paine lambswool are really nice.
Not nearly as accomplished, Eagle - but of a feather. However once I fell to the siren song of O'Connell's, since they are only 25 minutes away and created the great sin of my life: paying full retail.LOL. My closet is filled with purchases from Brooks Brothers, J. Press, O'Connell's, Orvis, Allen Edmonds, Alden, etc., and I have paid full retail price for almost nothing. Now that's the ticket!
PS: There have been a few (too many) high flyer purchases over the years, but those have been driven by a lack of patience on my part. It is the patient hunter who gets the kill!
Even typing it feels dirty. But like many of the fallen at least I only did it once.
Fixed that for you.
You can still do well with LL Bean and Lands End for basics, especially on sale. Sales at Brooks Brothers can still be good for basic suits and blazers.
Then, discipline...
Put yourself on a strict clothing diet. Simply don't buy crap like T-shirts and other cheap landfill fashion, which doesn't last and winds up costing more in the long run. Money saved here, in small amounts over time, leaves plenty for good stuff that does last.
TCO of jeans is awful too. Wear khakis instead.
Then, discipline...
Put yourself on a strict clothing diet. Simply don't buy crap like T-shirts and other cheap landfill fashion, which doesn't last and winds up costing more in the long run. Money saved here, in small amounts over time, leaves plenty for good stuff that does last.
TCO of jeans is awful too. Wear khakis instead.
I still remember fondly building my business wardrobe. It was summer in Dallas. BB had an inexpensive line of worsted suits, and I got a dark grey chalk stripe and a white and a blue OCBD to expand my one suit, one blazer, and two shirt wardrobe. Later that summer I added a tan poplin and a light grey linen, also from BB. They lasted me until I was no longer 40/28, by which time my finances had evened out. I had two pair of shoes, both from Barrie, black wingtips and a gorgeous honey brown tassel. They, too, lasted many, many more years, basically retired because my feet spread as I aged. If I were a 9D instead of a 10E I’d still be wearing them! And that was 1975.
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