[J. Fields Collins]

This may be somewhat off topic but lately I have been noticing some of the collars of my OCBDs become somewhat 'ragged' to say the least. Especially where the 'crease' is from ironing and folding it over.

I would assume that this is due to excessive wear around them, or that my five-o-clock shadow and stubble could do this prematurely. This is a new phenomenon to me, yet I have been shaving for years as a young man. Surely this is not due to my rather 'hirsute' nature. I was hoping it was the way I wash them, iron them or hang them dry. I usually wash, hang dry then iron them with no starch.

Is this the case?
Does anyone else have problems like this?
Is this really facial hair?
If so, what do you do about it, shave twice a day?

Thank you in advance for the help,
J.

 

[Markus]

What brand of OCBD are you buying?

In my experience none of the better brands do this soon. I have Press, BB and gitman shirts that are years and years old, washed, laundered, starched, pressed countless times that show no signs of fraying.

So I put it to you again, what brand of shirts are you buying that are fraying so quickly?

Best regards,

Markus

 

[mpcsb]

As another 'hirsute', my beard does have something to do with it and I do often shave twice a day. Most all of my ocbd shirts are older Brooks. I don't think they've frayed particularly fast, but then I do buy them with a bit more neck room than normal - I usually size up. No startch for me and I seldom iron them. Fortunately I don't mind frayed collars. I'll be interested in what others say.

 

[J. Fields Collins]

Originally I wanted to keep brands out of the conversation due to the conversation that ensues when you bring up such things. However, I have noticed it on both BB OCBDs and a little more significantly on my RLPL OCBDs. I have not noticed it on my Bean ones (have a fewer number and do not wear as much as the other two, which probably affects them) and there is none on my handful of Press ones. (Not Troy shirts).

I was originally assuming it was not a 'quality' thing and that it was a number of wearings aspect. But I have heard the stories of men wearing thier BBs for decades. What gives?

Maybe shave 'against the grain' on my neck? (sheesh I have not done that since I was an enlisted USMC)

Thanks,
J.

 

[mpcsb]

But I have heard the stories of men wearing thier BBs for decades. What gives?

Maybe shave 'against the grain' on my neck? (sheesh I have not done that since I was an enlisted USMC)

Thanks,
J.

I think the wearing for decades is for folks who have several dozen in rotation, like my dad did. I think it may also include when they are frayed.

PS I always shave against the grain, like that smooth feel - :icon_smile_wink:

 

[eagle2250]

Just a bit of fraying can give the shirt added character, presumably acquired through long and faithful service. I would think an extraordinarily rough beard could be exacerbating the situation and if such is the case, wearing a somewhat larger collar might be the answer.

 

[kforton]

As a solution, you can have your collars flipped. A tailor will unsew the collar, flip it and resew it to the body of the shirt. My dry cleaner does it for $12 per shirt. In fact, I am wearing one right now. It will double the life of my shirt. Mine wear in the back of the neck. It may be from getting them laundered and pressed, but I can't stand the rumpled look so frayed collars is the price I pay.

 

[Rocker]

In a way, I think having your shirts starched helps prevent this as the starch hardens and smooths the fibers down. The "fuzziness" of the cotton fibers in a loose weave shirt like oxford is minimized so that the stubble on one's neck/chin is less likely to "catch" on the cotton fibers and cause fraying. No empircal evidence on this - just my theory.

 

[septa]

I don't have much to add, but I can confirm what others have said.

1) I find a little starch nicely protects the collar and cuffs. My mother, whose wisdom of trad has been confirmed independantly by this board, explained that starch protects the fibers by making them "hard" as rocker said, and more importantly for me, protects it from sweat. The starch picks it up instead of the shirt, and it can then be washed out. Thus the unstarched look was both a lazy college boy thing, and a status symbol--peppies didn't need thier shirts to last a long time.

2) Turning the collar and cuffs is a great deal, that most people don't know about.

3)B.B. ocbds do last a long time, but it is limited by the number of washes. The more shrts you have and the less they are washed the longer they will wear. I had some that between my dad and I were worn once a week (maybe less) for probably 25 years. With the starch we probably averaged a little less than 2 washes per wear, lets say 1.75 wears per wash, if my math works out this equals...somewhere in the range of 800 washes. hmm this seems a little high, but not unreasonable. I will say that by the time I was finished with them in college they looked like something sold by the current incarnation of Abercrombie and Fitch, they were pretty much destroyed. Almost in shreds.

 

[mpcsb]

... Thus the unstarched look was both a lazy college boy thing, and a status symbol--peppies didn't need thier shirts to last a long time.

Oooouch! LOL

 

[longwing]

Has anyone else noticed that the cuff pleats on recent BB OCBDs are not quite right? Makes me wonder if I should upgrade to Mercer or downgrade to 346. Not sure which.

 

[Untilted]

LongWing, always go up, never go down.

I wear all my OCBDs (I have about 7) once a week and 1 wash per wear. Let's see how they will come out by the time I graduate. I just found a hole on a Press ocbd, it's about half a year old I think (WOW I've been on AAAT for half a year!). I doubt it's J.Press's fault, I probably messed it up myself when I was cleaning the house or moving the furniture.

 

[Kingsfield]

I have read of preps actually employing sandpaper to hasten the wear of new OCBDs collars and cuffs.

 

[Tom Rath]

Rough stubble can wreak havoc on my OCBDs. All of mine show wear very quickly on the collar, at the neck area. There isnt much that can be done, its part of the charm of the fabric I think.

Id agree starch would help, but then again people like A. Kabbaz (who really knows his stuff), says to never starch shirts because its bad for them. So it seems silly to do that to save the collar fray only to sacrifice the lifespan of the shirt. Im not a fan of starching, never have been, never will be. Cant understand the logic of making a shirt feel like cardboard.

 

[septa]

I don't think a little starch, on the inside of the collar and cuff, added when ironing really makes the shirt feel like cardboard or hurts the fibers that much. As I'm a sweaty person I've found it reduces unsightly dark rings around the collar and cuff, but I'm no expert. I've used light starch and gotten loads of wear out of my shirts...I'd like to know if I am really doing something wrong.

 

[Tom Rath]

Im sure the less you use the better. What I have heard and read is that starch makes the fibers brittle.

I simply dont like the way it feels. It seems counterintuitive to me. Buy a shirt with nice soft fabric and then purposely make it feel rough and cardboard like. To each his own ofcourse. I will say it makes the shirt look neater.

 

[Markus]

I'm a long-time starcher...

1. it doesn't make the collar feel rough like cardboard. It makes it feel smooth.
2. granted, most of the time I don't go with heavy starch, but my shirts have lasted years and years. Of course, this is not a scientific study, since I haven't kept track of how many shirts I have in my rotation or how many times they've been washed, starched etc.
3. I like the way a heavily starched cuff or collar look, just personal preference. But i don't seem to wear them that way very often. Usually you can't tell the difference with mine.

Markus

 

[Rocker]

Id agree starch would help, but then again people like A. Kabbaz (who really knows his stuff), says to never starch shirts because its bad for them. So it seems silly to do that to save the collar fray only to sacrifice the lifespan of the shirt. Im not a fan of starching, never have been, never will be. Cant understand the logic of making a shirt feel like cardboard.

Well, maybe on very fine 2x200s Swiss Cotton but, I've always had my BB OCBDs commercially washed and starched and they last for numerous years.

 

[Tom Rath]

Fair points gentleman. I will still defer to someone like Mr. Kabbaz on such issues however.

You are really telling me that starch doesnt make your shirts feel hard? Smooth sure, but cardboard like. Rocks are smooth too. Every so often I get one back from the cleaners that got starched and I can almost hold the thing out sideways, parallel to the ground.

 

[GMC]

Can't we all just get along?

Kidding with that title. :icon_smile: But I think the answer here is: everyone's right: Starch does make your shirt collar smooth and keep the fibers from sticking out and being susceptible to fraying. But it also breaks down fibers, which is why a lot of shirt makers advise against it. Good shirts can stand up to light starch. Heavy starch is hard on all shirts. And starch either feels fine -- or doesn't -- depending on your preference. And preferences have a lot to do with what we got used to. It's about your personal comfort zone.