^ It just... is. Once you've seen a number of button-down collars, you notice that they're not all the same, that some look good and some look bad. Certainly subjective regarding which is which.
Examples of the proper roll...
Perhaps there is already a voluminous thread on this. But with all the threads featuring pictures of Cordovan Tassle loafers, odes to the bit loafer, or other favorite trad attire...is there a thread showing a plethora of pictures featuring proper rolls on our various beloved button-down collars? I'd start one, but I'm a bit technically challenged and don't have a digital camera. I remember what could only have been an epiphany showing me my fondness for the trad look back in the '70s--when everyone was wearing hideous polyester shirts and leisure suits. I drove past a bill board advertising for a local politician. It was a close up of him in black and white with a perfectly rolled OCBD and rep tie with a four-in-hand knot. Not being anywhere near a Brooks Bros. or the the like at the time, it took several years to locate an OCBD (Gant) and a visit to a larger city where I happened into a traditional menswear shop and found some OCBD Seros and regimental striped ties. Wore them till I was able to move up to Gitman Bros and BB. One look at the proper collar and tie presentation can indeed change a man for life. At least in the way he dresses!
21 - 34 of 34 Posts
^ Yes, it's hard to explain. Or, rather, can't be explained. Of course it's a matter of opinion...but the settled body of opinion seems to hold that the roll gives the shirt a certain breezy or jaunty quality.
And there is also the matter of precedent. If you look at early pictures of button-down shirts (incl. old Apparel Arts drawings) you'll see that they always sport the roll. Brooks, the standard-bearer of the OCBD shirt, always had a significant roll to its collars. And so for at least 30-40 years, shirts without a roll have looked like a sort of cheap imitation of the original.
tjs
And there is also the matter of precedent. If you look at early pictures of button-down shirts (incl. old Apparel Arts drawings) you'll see that they always sport the roll. Brooks, the standard-bearer of the OCBD shirt, always had a significant roll to its collars. And so for at least 30-40 years, shirts without a roll have looked like a sort of cheap imitation of the original.
tjs
And, of course, the very design of the button-down collar requires a roll of some kind, however minimal it may be. Not all button-down collars will roll the same way, but they will all roll. From there, it's just a matter of opinion on which rolls look good and which don't.
So, to answer stfu's question, it's not so much collar roll that is desired as it is proper collar roll. Just as people have opinions on proper trouser break or proper shoulder padding, they have opinions on proper collar roll.
So, to answer stfu's question, it's not so much collar roll that is desired as it is proper collar roll. Just as people have opinions on proper trouser break or proper shoulder padding, they have opinions on proper collar roll.
My lone LE OCBD has a great collar roll. Yours don't?Great collar roll from Eastvillage. Why don't my shirts do that? Do I need to bite the bullet and move up from LE OCBDs?
^ Hmm. Maybe we could use more pix: Poor rolls. Great rolls.
I would love to see some examples of less-than-desireable collar rolls.
Most the pix in this thread either lack a tie -- or are taken from a very low angle, emphasizing the hole in the roll.
I would love to see some examples of less-than-desireable collar rolls.
Most the pix in this thread either lack a tie -- or are taken from a very low angle, emphasizing the hole in the roll.
Fred Astaire would agree with the "jaunty quality" opinion, as he was into a softer more casual look (i.e. the brown suede shoes, etc.). He even wore BDs with a DB suit; probably a mistake. While it can be said the BD is probably the least dressy and most jaunty dress shirt collar, probably the tab collar is the most "uptight" looking, and the cutaway (Prince Charles' favorite) is the most formal. However, it is mostly a matter of personal taste and preferences and there are no rigid rules here.^ Yes, it's hard to explain. Or, rather, can't be explained. Of course it's a matter of opinion...but the settled body of opinion seems to hold that the roll gives the shirt a certain breezy or jaunty quality.
And there is also the matter of precedent. If you look at early pictures of button-down shirts (incl. old Apparel Arts drawings) you'll see that they always sport the roll. Brooks, the standard-bearer of the OCBD shirt, always had a significant roll to its collars. And so for at least 30-40 years, shirts without a roll have looked like a sort of cheap imitation of the original.
tjs
I'll offer a photograph or two to help develop our roll knowledge or preference.
![]()
This isn't the best roll, but it's not bad considering the pressure that is applied by the combination of my big head and short neck (Costanza syndrome).
I don't have any more examples, the rest of my roles are hidden by bows, but I hope this inspires some more pics.
This isn't the best roll, but it's not bad considering the pressure that is applied by the combination of my big head and short neck (Costanza syndrome).
I don't have any more examples, the rest of my roles are hidden by bows, but I hope this inspires some more pics.
Here's a quote from Allan Flusser's "Clothes and the Man," I think he has said it all.This thread gives me the opportunity to ask something I have often wondered:Simply, Why is a collar roll so desirable on an OCBD?I know it may be a subjective question, but I am interested in responses.
The Button-Down Collar
The button-down collar was first introduced in this country by Brooks Brothers, patterned after the polo shirt worn in England. As explained earlier, the collar was originally fastened down in order to prevent flapping in the player's face during a match. This collar, unlike all others, is soft and meant to remain that way. It is without doubt the most comfortable collar and represents nothing less than the American spirit by producing a casual image so in tune with our heritage. It has been popular every decade since the twenties, and since its origins are definitely in sport, it is not considered a particularly dressy collar. Since it never lies exactly the same way, it offers an unpredictable buckling about the neck, thereby reflecting the wearer's individuality. It is a collar long associated with the Ivy League look and is especially complementary to the natural-shoulder suit. It is appropriately worn with tweed sports jackets and women suits. The Brooks Brothers original model remains the best version, for its points are long, permitting a "roll" that changes as the wearer moves. The button-down collar will accommodate a Windsor knot or a four-in-hand, and when worn with a bow tie, it projects the ultimate professorial image.
[Bizarrely, someone seems to have put the entire text of the book online. https://www.throughtherye.com/flusser/ch7part2.htm ]
Assymetry
The beauty of the Brooks BD is that the roll is often asymmetrical. Sero, I think, marketed the "Liberty Bell" shape or roll. Their idea of a firm, symmetrical roll exactly missed the whole point.
The beauty of the Brooks BD is that the roll is often asymmetrical. Sero, I think, marketed the "Liberty Bell" shape or roll. Their idea of a firm, symmetrical roll exactly missed the whole point.
Main Entry: 3roll Function:noun Date:1688 1 a: a sound produced by rapid strokes on a drum b: a sonorous and often rhythmical flow of speech c: a heavy reverberatory sound <the roll of cannon>2: a rolling movement or an action or process involving such movement <a roll of the dice> <an airplane's takeoff roll>: as a: a swaying movement of the body b: a side-to-side movement (as of a ship or train)
Today's collar roll did not want to be encumbered by the sweater:
21 - 34 of 34 Posts
- This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Men's Clothing Forums
A forum community dedicated to men’s fashion and clothing enthusiasts. Come join the discussion about collections, materials, models, styles, scales, reviews, accessories, classifieds, and more!
Full Forum Listing
Explore Our Forums
Top Contributors this Month
View All
Oldsarge
134 Replies
Vecchio Vespa
45 Replies
Preppy Climber
35 Replies
Recommended Communities
