The late Joe Putnal, of Spencer's here in Atlanta, once told me that he went to the Troy Guild plant in NY. He saw hundreds of Brooks Brothers' shirt boxes, full of shirts made by Troy, ready to be shippped out. If true, this would seem to indicate that Troy knew how to make the Brooks BD roll. Your opinion?The BB roll was the one every shirtmaker tried to copy. The Gant brothers, Marty and Elliot, bought Brooks shirts, took them apart, traced the different parts and assembled the shirts. The roll would never be "right". The Brooks roll, much like the formula for Coca Cola-( there are a number of cola beverages that, when chemically analyzed, are the same as Coke. They don't taste the same.) has never been successfully copied perfectly. Gant and Sero came closer than anyone else. We developed our own BD pattern that we had made by Troy Guild Shirtmakers- when they were really Troy Guild in the 60s. We still make that collar today.
Paul Winston
Winston Tailors
www.chipp2.com
Atlanta's most Trad specialty shop; Norman Hilton, Troy Guild and Alden. It was much better than either Stockton or Guffey's. All items were sold under Spencer's own private label. Stockton's had exclusive rights to use the Hilton label. The elder Mr. Spencer used to go to England and buy bolts of really unusual and fine fabrics, which the store sent off to Hilton for MTM.I'm curious where (and exactly what) Spencer's was. I used to shop at Muse's and Zachry, and I've heard of Parkes-Chambers.
Fred Astaire would agree with the "jaunty quality" opinion, as he was into a softer more casual look (i.e. the brown suede shoes, etc.). He even wore BDs with a DB suit; probably a mistake. While it can be said the BD is probably the least dressy and most jaunty dress shirt collar, probably the tab collar is the most "uptight" looking, and the cutaway (Prince Charles' favorite) is the most formal. However, it is mostly a matter of personal taste and preferences and there are no rigid rules here.^ Yes, it's hard to explain. Or, rather, can't be explained. Of course it's a matter of opinion...but the settled body of opinion seems to hold that the roll gives the shirt a certain breezy or jaunty quality.
And there is also the matter of precedent. If you look at early pictures of button-down shirts (incl. old Apparel Arts drawings) you'll see that they always sport the roll. Brooks, the standard-bearer of the OCBD shirt, always had a significant roll to its collars. And so for at least 30-40 years, shirts without a roll have looked like a sort of cheap imitation of the original.
tjs
