new designer in menswear doing research (US patented collar designs for dress shirts)

[eric glennie]

Good Evening Gentlemen ! I am a new fashion designer in the business and i am doing some market research to see what the menswear community thinks about new collar styles. I U.S. patented these collars many years ago and i would like to know if men are willing to wear unique dress shirts collars. Please view my website www.ericglennie. com to view some unique collar designs perhaps you may have never seen before. I shaped dress shirt collars around the necktie knot to show the neckline with a cleaner style by placing the collar points behind the necktie. Thanks gentlemen for your time and hope you enjoy my art. Please let me know what you think or dont think about a new collar style for menswear. Thanks again Eric Glennie. 952-913-8708

[neyus]

Some of your designs seem to be taking influence from Goodfellas. They are certainly different. They seem too hollywood for me.

You might be interested in these shirts as well

http://www.precisiontailors.com.au/shirts/

[rip]

Absolutely not! Your collars don't seem to allow for differing knot sizes, something I enjoy playing with, and, as the previous poster observed, it's a bit too goombah for me.

[eric glennie]

thanks rip for your reply. breaking tradition is difficult. for many years the focal point of the mans neckline has been the tie knot. my designs break that tradition and make the focal point of the neckline the collar. the color or pattern of the necktie shows thru the various collar designs producing a consistent tie knot. no matter how horrendous the tie knot is constucted, only the color of the tie shows thru the collar rather than construction or type of knot. i enjoy challenging tradition and thinking outside the box. that is what fashion is all about. if i wanted to be a designer in today's market , than i would just print out a bunch of labels and place them on the same old , traditional dress shirt and call myself a designer. i hope you enjoy my art because i am not just a label, but a fashion designer. thanks for your response. i really appreciate your point of view. eric glennie.

[mafoofan]

Breaking with tradition is fine, so long as you've got a coherent reason for it. Why do you want to change the focus from a man's tie knot to his collar? Yes, your collars look weird, but that's not a problem in and of itself. The real problem to me is that I don't think they'd flatter many faces and the design doesn't make any sense.

By narrowing the opening for the tie to show through, you are also increasing the expanse of open cloth in the collar. That increased expanse and narrow sliver of tie will make any face look wider than it already is.

Also, if you want to break with tradition and draw attention away from the tie, why incorporate a tie in your thinking to begin with? Long-staying styles tend to be true to underlying structures and components. Your collar hides the tie underneath and thus, as a design, fights to free itself from a context that it need not adopt in the first place. This is either aethetically incoherent or timid, depending on how you look at it.

[arnach]

Please let me know what you think or dont think about a new collar style for menswear. Thanks again Eric Glennie. 952-913-8708

I don't intend to be crude, and I mean this in all seriousness:

Your collar styles seem to be highly evocative of female genitalia.

[EAP]

Eric,

The patent numbers referenced on your site should be prefixed with "D" as in D396,539, as they are design patents, not utility patents. Utility patent 396,539 would date to 1889. Others (potential licensees) might not catch this and come up empty on a search.

I believe that any and all feedback received here will be in contrast to classic style. Consequently, I wouldn't expect acceptance. Fashion ≠ style. Not here.

I'm here to learn and mostly keep quiet, however I do understand patents and will break squelch occasionally.

Check out http://thesouthsbest.com/product_inf...products_id=23 (from a Trad forum post) as a prime example of an excellent design with a market, furthermore one that could have potentially benefited from a design patent to prevent copying. But the key here is having a market.

[Faded501s]

Did you license some of these to Stacy Adams?

[yachtie]

Some of your designs seem to be taking influence from Goodfellas. They are certainly different. They seem too hollywood for me.

You might be interested in these shirts as well

http://www.precisiontailors.com.au/shirts/

Looks like potentially invalidating prior art to me...

[eric glennie]

thanks faded 501's for taking a look at my website. I did talk to Stacy Adams in New York City and they directed me to their corportate offices in Milwaukee, Wi. The secretary said Stacy Adams has their own inhouse design team and they are not interested in taking a look at a freelance designers new ideas. I have had numerous companies tell me this so i will have to blaze this trail solo. I would like to sign a licensing agreement with an established designer or manufacturing looking for a designer like myself. Most companies are unwilling to take a chance with a new idea . The markets on these collar have not been tested and i dont have the money to advertise my designs thru the media. For that company that wants to try my unique dress shirts in their stores or develop a partnership , we can sign a risk-free licensing agreement to see if there is a market for my designs. These collars can bomb or they could be the next greatest idea in fashion. who know unless these shirts are marketed! I believe my market is the Stacy Adams customer, so if there is a company looking for a new designer please forward my information. thanks eric.

[Orgetorix]

for many years the focal point of the mans neckline has been the tie knot. my designs break that tradition and make the focal point of the neckline the collar.

Eric,

I'm not sure how your design achieves this. From the pictures on your site, the effect initially reminded me of that produced by pinned or tab collars, which, if anything, make the tie knot more prominent. Seems like you've achieved the opposite of the effect you were going for, here.

[eric glennie]

thanks for your response Arnach. i appreciate your comments about my collars seeming femine. Lets ask the ladies in the fashion forum or the ladies in your lives what they think about my style in dress shirts collars. I have had some wonderful responses from the ladies about my dress shirt collars. High fashion menswear doesnt neccessarity correlate to masculinity. If you are a fan of mens fashion, take a look at the catwalk of europe and see what the men are wearing. would you consider cravats (mens scarves) femine? would you consider banded collars as femine? would you consider mens plaform shoes as femine? would you consider wearing a tshirt under a blazer ( the preppy or yuppy look of the early 80's) like Don Johnson of miami vice as femine? how about men piercing both ears, wearing pastel dress shirts, or wearing makeup (gothic) as femine? I know its hard to break out of the traditional ozzie and harriet menswear , but todays 20-35 year old men are looking for new styles. agree or disagree. thanks eric

[jackmccullough]

I know its hard to break out of the traditional ozzie and harriet menswear , but todays 20-35 year old men are looking for new styles. agree or disagree. thanks eric

If you spend some time on these boards, reading the posts and looking at the photos that the members post, you will see that this is not predominantly a group of guys who are into "Ozzie and Harriet menswear".

I get the impression that you have already decided that anyone who doesn't like the design is closed-minded and unwilling ton consider anything new, but I've observed that many, many people on this forum are interested in new ideas, and regularly say that coming to AAAC has opened their eyes to the possibilities of good clothing.

That said, I also have to say that these collars are some of the worst-looking things I've seen this side of Joe Pesci's wardrobe in "Goodfellas".

No offense intended, but you asked.

[eric glennie]

thanks for your response mafoofan! the only styles of dress shirt collar i have seen are in the shape of an A-frame. the traditional collar has the apex under the chin with legs moving outward at 45 degree angles. as the (arc angle) of the apex increases the collar points (arc length) spreads out further and further. the farther the spread the more horizontal the collar and thus reducing height. i want to keep the eye up and down on the collar rather than moving horizontal to maintain height. the same principle that vertical stripes on a shirt make a person look taller than horizontal stripes. my goal and purpose is to keep the collar points vertical and close to the center line ( the line that runs from the forehead thru the middle of the eyes down the bridge of the nose over the chin on the way to the navel). keeping a true vertical line from chin to tieknot makes a man look taller, straighter, and in the fashion sense more balanced (beautiful). the eye is trained to follow the collar away from the center line in a traditional mens dress shirt , but in my collar the eye follows the collar down from chin to chest. i believe there isnt a collar in the world, no matter what the experts say that can increase height, but my collar maintains height by keepiing the eye vertical. i dont know if you are a physics guy, but keeping lines true to the center lines with the collars running vertical and close to the centerline maintains perceived height. thanks eric glennie.

[arnach]

I know its hard to break out of the traditional ozzie and harriet menswear , but todays 20-35 year old men are looking for new styles. agree or disagree. thanks eric

I did not say your collars were feminine. I stated that you collars look like vaginas. There is a difference. I understand the intrusion of feminity into menswear and fashion, but it is a different concept than what I was speaking of.



Does anyone else agree with me?

[ptolbert]

Well, I do not think that these collars will find their way into my wardrobe. Many men hold the fact that the tie is to add a bit of panache to the wardrobe, I am not fond of hiding the knot at all.

In fact, tying the knot is part of the art of dressing, why hide it?

Many of the Urban Fashion stores around the country sell shirts with similar collars, (no tie space, etc), because its different. But that is a very tiny market share in most markets.

[jackmccullough]

. i believe there isnt a collar in the world, no matter what the experts say that can increase height, but my collar maintains height by keepiing the eye vertical.

Don't worry. I don't think you will find anyone who claims that a shirt collar makes you taller.

[mclean5]

Those designs are interesting. Most of the people here, however -- and I include myself -- are more interested in dressing to an existing canon of aesthetics. This might not be the best place to show off radical departures from that canon and expect an enthusiastic response. I know I wouldn't consider buying these shirts. They don't fit the traditon I want to pursue.

For the same reason, mass-marketing these shirts through an existing firm might be very difficult. They too have a canon that's worked for them in the past, and will likely work in future, and they don't want to change for no pressing reason.

Have you thought of selling these shirts yourself in a custom-order setting? That might be your best bet of making money on these things.

[wasabe]

Ugh, no. For me, the spreader, the better.

[Mitchell]

Under the catagory "Eric's Original design," the collar merely looks like a re-hash of a tab collar. I'll give you credit for being able to tie a nice tie knot. But what's the sense? The collars look as if they're the wrong size and that the wearer is compensating by pulling the tie too tight.

The balance in my opinion are silly and affectacious. They go beyond "Godfather," and into the land of overpaid sports figures and car dealers one would wish to avoid. I would not want my doctor or attorney to show up wearing that style.

[eric glennie]

thanks McClean 5. Over the past 12 years, i have sent my designs to professional athletes ( NBA and NFL) players, movie studios, tv studios, celebrities, news networks, fashion editors, newspaper editors, designers, and manufacturers. Lots of doors closed , not a lot of warm fuzzies, and hard to get a hold of people. However, I have had one collar show up in the media . Whomever watched the movie Swordfish ( John Travolta) was wearing one of my collars and also Espn analysts have been seen with my collar #2a. Has anyone seen these collars on these programs and what do you think? thanks eric

[mafoofan]

Eric, if you could just use vertical lines to emphasize a man's vertical dimension, why doesn't a single line drawn up the center of a shirt or sweater do the trick?

What you've neglected to consider is that every time you create a vertical line, you bisect one plane into two. These large expanses of cloth make surface areas appear larger than they really are. The reason why spread collars work so well on so many men is because they create space and depth; your collars do the opposite. An exposed tie does a much better job of emphasizing a man's vertical dimension than your collars since it draws a definite line upward, yet body and width itself, preventing the creation of any large, flat expanses of fabric.

By closing the collar over the tie knot, the tie essentially begins beneath the collar points. Thus, the collar itself becomes a wide horizonal bar across the neck; cutting an 'A' into it is exactly what is needed to provide a resolved transition between collar and tie while drawing the eyes upward up along the tie's length.

Anyway, have you considered what I said about fighting against an unnecessary context? You cover the tie--why not just get rid of it? If you want to be successful in the fashion industry, you need to have some command over the theory underlying good design.

[sia]

Way too fashion-forward/fad-ish for me. These may have some place as club-wear for the 18-20-something year old crowd, but, in my opinion, would be beyond consideration for use in any traditional business or social environment.

[fauxpaspa]

What is not acceptable is directions of fashion that suggest a lower class or criminal aesthetic or origin.

you should look at hip-hop fashion. there's definitely some kind of "gangsta" thing going on there.

and i read somewhere that in the 20's when criminals like al capone were on the loose, the gangster-look they cultivated was quite popular.


also, the biggest influence on fashion nowadays is popular music, like rap and grunge (or rock and disco in earlier decades). this music almost always comes from the lower classes.

even the upper class is now trying to emulate the lower classes - eg, cheap chic, designer jeans and t-shirts, slob fashion, etc.

[eric glennie]

hello again mafoofan! i love ties and i think they are a neccessary accessory to any mans wardrobe. the necktie is where we get our color and variety in the wardrobe. we would all look alike except for different colored shirts and jackets without neckties. i dont want to get rid of neckties, i just want to cover the tieknot and bring the color or pattern of the tie in a different look at the knot line. i believe the necktie is a functionless piece of colored or patterned silk who sole purpose is to add color and dimension. ties draw out the background color of the shirt and draw in the color of the jacket to produce a matching wardrobe. the tie also adds a 3rd dimension in the wardrobe bridging jacket and shirt in a layered effect. i am not reinventing the wheel , just adding a different set of hubcaps. once again, i love ties but would like to see them worn in a different light. thanks eric.